Night wrote:Thanks guys!
Doing some more tweaking, does the head look alright from the front and side?

Meesa' lookin good!

You should give me your .blend and I could maybe make an alternate version of 682.

ow lawd
Sure, if you have an idea for it, I'll send you it tomorrow I suppose after I'm done with all the final tweaking and stuff.

The model is looking nice Night and I like your approach to 682. It would be awesome to have 682 in game. To that end I offer you my help. While I doubt I will be much use to you on the modeling front I can help you with 2d stuff. I could make 3d orthographics and provide you with other drawings/digital paintings. I have been painting 682 for a while (albeit a very different version) at the very least hopefully I can provide you with some ideas.
Now I realize this is a work in progress. However I do have some constructive criticisms I feel the need to voice, keep in mind these are just my opinions. While I like how you are going for a swift 682 I’m not sure if it's a good idea to base the body structure on animals like gallimimus, they were herbivores and not built to kill. Personality I think dromaeosaurs like utahraptor would be a better place to start. For example.
http://scotthartman.deviantart.com/art/ ... -298533490
http://fc09.deviantart.net/fs71/i/2010/ ... 2yv4nf.jpg
Maybe even the “relatively” lightly built spinosaurus would work.
http://qilong.files.wordpress.com/2011/ ... urus-9.jpg
So the chest area looks very small in proportion to the rest of the body. The tail is huge and could use some thinning down. Along with the thighs which look really high up. It might also be a good idea to lower the overall posture. Because unless 682 is fairly small we might run into the issue that the player will only see his feet, unless he takes the time to look up.
Also just an idea but the only official photo of 682 we have is when he is in his injured state. As the beluga whale very well illustrates some animal’s skeletons look very different from the living breathing creature. You have room to take to artistic liberties.
Those are all the things I can up with right now. Again this is just my opinion take it or leave it, it's your model and I am confident you will do 682 justice. Feel free to message me if you want anything. Sorry if I came across as an ass I just want to give a hand. Feel free to give the 680-2 model a scathing critique. Once again looking good so far and good luck.
Moonsaber,

Thanks!
That's alright, thanks for the offer, I'll tell you if I need anything!
Sure, but I'm taking the more fast speed aspect of their build rather than the very light build overall, which you can see I highly changed with the muscle mass and different bone structures on other places. You can see in the picture I uploaded that the feet for an instance, unlike with gallimimus, are much more closer to something that a t-rex would have; along with the arms, which resemble something more like what a carnivorous dinosaur would have. So I'm not really should what you mean, I took liberty with the way its built rather than go on a certain path with one reference.
Here's what it looks like so far. You can immediately notice what I've mentioned, added body and muscle mass, and different skeletal structure (arms, feet, tail, neck). Now, the part I can agree on that does look herbivorous is the skull, seeing as it's jaw is long and its lower jaw (masster region to be more specific) is big; and of course the lack of very sharp teeth on the front, but hey, I was going a bit more with the reference of the beluga whale skull, and slightly altering its looks (you can see how I initially wanted it to look in the smiley ).
The chest area, if I'm not mistaken, is generally really small for all dinosaurs. And is probably bigger in carnivorous ones, but I might be mistaken. About the tail. I probably will, after you mentioned it, make it longer and thinner, seeing as I mainly went on the basis of "does it fit?" with it, so thanks.

Well, I don't really know about changing the posture, since I'm not sure where you'll see him, but it would probably not be in the facility corridors of the main game (not enough place for that damn thing!).

Yeah of course, but I like the way the skull looks like, so I think I'll keep it more or less the way it is now.

No no dude, that's cool, I actually like the fact you came to mention all of these stuff! Gives me some more food for thought before I start with the main model assets. And don't worry about sounding like an ass, you didn't, I think I sounded like an ass myself with my response if anything.

I've always believed that SCP-682 would look better standing on four legs but that's just my opinion.

I'd like to suggest, just like Moonsaber, to change the posture a bit. SCP-682 sees too tall. However, that could be easily changed by lengthening the body or shortening the hind legs, which I think is easier. The model would be as follows:
This is the best example I can give. SCP-682 is more robust, obviously.

First of thank you, I have done some critiques which did not go down well. I have done some thinking and I have come with a few more critiques and food for thought.
Now that you mention it, and with the different view I see your changes and your right it is more carnivorous than herbivorous. Also I did some more research and your right most bipedal dinosaurs have a relatively small chest. The chest size of carnivores tends to have more mass in the chest to support the weight of a heavy head. Speaking of which I found this image of a clean and undamaged Beluga whale skull
http://paleo.cc/ce/plesio-russ/belugaskull.jpg
You might want to go off that skull for reference because it looks more monstrous and carnivorous. Also while I know those are not exactly eye sockets, and you already have most of the head modeled out. But six eyes would be fun and interesting, another thing to do with the head you might want to add some mass around the jaw area. Carnivores need muscle to bite through flesh.
http://d3lp4xedbqa8a5.cloudfront.net/s3 ... -snout.jpg
I need to go back to my posture argument and elaborate further. Now for this set of arguments I’m going to assume he is about the size of a t rex. The way you have 682 now puts his really head high up like he wants to eat some leaves off a high tree. If he wanted to eat someone he would need to bend down. I like the claws however 682 would still need to bend down in order to use them to the fullest effect. I like the idea of human like hands for claws. But you might want to look into therizinosaurus and spinosaurus as dinosaurs that used their forelimbs as weapons, however the human hands are still pretty cool.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... arison.png
Thanks for listening, keep up the good work and have a nice day.
Moonsaber

Thanks for the suggestions guys, I appreciate it!

About the posture; it's a little problematic taking pictures like these as posture references because the dinosaurs depicted in them aren't idle, but seem rather like they're enraged and/or about to start running. I'll still see what I can do, but I think that making his posture like in those pictures mostly has to do with the animations.

Moonsaber wrote:

Haha, I actually used this picture as reference, but wanted to preserve polygons when going about the teeth, I'm starting to rethink how I modeled the head so I will make some changes. About the 6 eyes suggestion, I think I'll leave it to the damaged version of 682, which Mirocaine will be making.
I'm a bit unsure about what you mean by adding mass around the jaw, can you explain a little further? Do you mean like adding sort of like.. folds/wrinkles around the jaw, or?
Coming back to posture from your point of view Moonsaber. I see what you mean ,and I even thought this a little thorougher, thinking about how the article says 682 changes a lot and all of that, in which case it would probably mean it would change accordingly to what fits its current situation the best. i.e if he has an enemy that is relatively short, 682's body would change in order to fit that height. But I beg to ask the question, what's wrong with bending?
Dinosaurs also bent down to prey that was shorter than theirs, and their tail was of great use to that, as it served as something like a balancing mechanism if I'm not mistaken.
Funnily enough I used this as reference for the hands, but I do like the idea of doing stuff like what therizinosaurus and spinosaurus had, it looks really cool, so thanks a lot about that idea, I'll definitely add something like that.
Thanks, have a good day as well.

I really don't like this model. It does not look alien or unnatural enough. There is nothing wrong with making it bipedal but you need to to give it more unesettling features. For example. Make its claws and eyes too big, or give it extra limbs and eyes, or make the proportions all wrong. It looks too much like a natural animal that could exist in real life. One of the details about 682 is its ability to adapt. I think that by now it probably looks nothing like the picture used 682 article and that picture was said to be taken when it was missing a whole lot of it's flesh anyway so you can't really use it anyway.

Personally, I think it would be good if you made the face a whole lot uglier with a much more imposing mouth, and gave it multiple pairs of legs.

Don't make it look like something that could exist in real life, make it look like something that SHOULD NOT exist in real life.

That's alright (srsly), I don't like the reasons you gave to back up that opinion though.
I should start of by saying that I don't understand your grudge at all unless you're the person who wrote the article about 682.

First off, you should have read what I wrote, there will be two models, one is this, the undamaged one, and the second one is the damaged with all the eyes, limbs, and shit like that which you take fancy to, so hopefully that makes you happier.

Secondly, you can't argue the whole "ability to adapt" thing, you could assume so many things about what it entails and what it is dependent on that it's useless, you could literally make up whatever you want with it.

So you go from telling me that it shouldn't look like something in real life, that would not work in real life; to that it doesn't make sense to make its head like it is now because of its flesh disintegrating and the ability to adapt? Do you see what's wrong with that? And who's to say 682 even has flesh on its face, or for that matter, its whole body?
And as I mentioned the ability to adapt argument can't be applied; I can just say that the ability to adapt, with the information given (and tell me if there's something I missed of course), modifies the existing bodily structure quickly and accordingly to the situation at present which has affected its body in a certain way, this would not mean any abnormal tumor like additions to its body like random limbs and retarded proportions, but rather something that would work in real life and would make sense anatomically, or to put it a bit differently and a little inaccurately (in terms of evolution) - 682 controlled self evolution with accelerated speed ; in which case you could say that its face wouldn't have changed after the incident had happened because there wouldn't be any reason for it (you're also loosely making some time references which I don't have a clue about "I think that by now it probably looks. . .").
Heck, you want an even more overboard example which is not in my favour in any way at all? It could mean that 682 would look like anything imaginable, it could look like a car, it could look like a flower, it could look like everything that you see when you type in "scp 682" into google images; my point being, it could look like everything. Where and how do you make the distinction of where the limit to its adaptability ends?

Funnily enough, without that second paragraph in the additional text given about 682 (the experiment log), you could interpret it like: "682 will get fatter if it eats more, and will get skinnier if it eats less very quickly" if you wanted.

Regardless of that though, the whole point in this build is that it makes sense to a certain degree, it's something that more than likely would work in real life; unlike you're oversimplified view of it which is "it looks out of this world durr hurr".

Wtf do you mean by looking too much like a "natural animal"? Do you think that aliens (even tho 682 could be from earth, which I should have addressed earlier but forgot) wouldn't look "natural"? That they would have a structure that would make sense for them to actually be considered somehow unnatural? Whatever that means.

I don't understand why make it look all fucked up and ugly anyway.. is it just for the sake of making it look cool? I mean, I'm fine with that and all, but I'd rather it be backed up by some rules that apply in the real world.

I have to say... this model is not my cup of tea. To me 682 does not resemble anything specific. It has only been stated as "vaguely reptile" looking and from that "legit picture" one would assume it walked on four legs (or however many legs it can have) Other than the skull shape, 682 should not look like either a crocodile nor a dinosaur.
To me this is a dinosaur, raptor... anything... but not 682.
Maybe because it looks too... clean... and normal. One should assume that 682 would look rather freakish wilth all the adaptions it had undergone during different SCP-testings.
(Like having a ton of eyes after the SCP-173 experiment) Also, it's safe to say that if 682 managed to escape the "acid bath" trap should at least affected it a little. Physically. And with Regalis already showing off 682's ability to enhance its limbs to tear down a helicopter HIGH UP IN THE AIR, one would assume that the body would match such a mutated long claw somewhat.

As much as I admire your work Night, I am not with you on this one sadly.

-edit-

Damn, you responded right before I posted this. You will always meet people who will disagree with you eventually Night. And we both do, and that's nothing bad.
682 looking mutated just for looking cool? Considering how well you worked with what the 096 article gave you back then I was simply surprised how much you invented into this, that is all.
Truly, SCPs will always be a matter of speculation though.