Undertow Games Forum

D-9999 wrote:Sort of like Omniary said, I would prefer not to BUY an addon that I could just as easily get for free. It really ruins the point of the workshop.

I'm not sure I follow, how is piracy an argument against putting a price on mods?

Awesomeguy147 wrote:Funny, I thought the point was to modify something for whatever purpose the creator of the mod chooses, but no, apparently the point of a mod is just to be free.

Also, any one charges a dollar for a reskin is just being stupid and they shouldn't be surprised when nobody uses it...... wait a minute, now that I think about isn't that what valve has been doing with TF2 for a while now, only more expensive............ does that render my previous point false?

One shouldn't be soley making a mod for monetary gain, they should be doing it to mix up or otherwise enhance the playing experience of themselves or others. It's not about making money, or getting the most upvotes, in my opinion. As long as people can come to appreciate whatever they put out there, then that's fine. It's about putting work into what you love to expand and improve upon it, not whipping out pages of addons for some cash (god forbid it reaches the Gmod workshop, overpriced fnaf fan models is the stuff of nightmares). Modding isn't a business. That's my opinion from my standpoint as an average joe.

Also, not sure if you've played TF2 or anything, but honestly, unlockables don't add much to the game. You could have just as much fun playing with all-stock (which are usually the best) items, as you would with every item in the game. No weapon you want you have to pay for in order to get, you're just going to have to earn it through hours (or other weapons).

Omniary wrote:One shouldn't be soley making a mod for monetary gain, they should be doing it to mix up or otherwise enhance the playing experience of themselves or others. It's not about making money, or getting the most upvotes, in my opinion. As long as people can come to appreciate whatever they put out there, then that's fine. It's about putting work into what you love to expand and improve upon it, not whipping out pages of addons for some cash (god forbid it reaches the Gmod workshop, overpriced fnaf fan models is the stuff of nightmares). Modding isn't a business. That's my opinion from my standpoint as an average joe.

While I agree that modding (or filmmaking, sound design, painting, academic research etc. for that matter) shouldn't be about money, I don't believe that's a good enough reason to enforce that anyone who wishes to set a price for their work shouldn't be able to do so because I don't agree with the idea.

I really think the validity of payware addons depends on the game.

It doesn't make much sense for games like GMod, Minecraft, and Turbo Dismount, but it makes much more sense for games like FS2004/FSX.

I feel like a game developer should be able to select whether to allow payware in the workshop for his game.

Omniary wrote:One shouldn't be soley making a mod for monetary gain, they should be doing it to mix up or otherwise enhance the playing experience of themselves or others. (...) Modding isn't a business.(...)

You can replace the italicised words with stuff like games/music/books/films, playing/listening/reading/viewing and Game Development/Music/Writing/Filming. All of those have been said numerous times, all of them are pretty wrong, and in the end, anything people want can be made a business. Many examples of "derived works" being sold too, and on the same medium.

Also to note making money with other people's games is a beaten topic regarding youtube monetization of Let's Play videos and whatnot. Some developers are cool with it, some are not, and others are somewhere in the middle.

Awesomeguy147 wrote:Funny, I thought the point was to modify something for whatever purpose the creator of the mod chooses, but no, apparently the point of a mod is just to be free.

Also, any one charges a dollar for a reskin is just being stupid and they shouldn't be surprised when nobody uses it...... wait a minute, now that I think about isn't that what valve has been doing with TF2 for a while now, only more expensive............ does that render my previous point false?

The difference here is that Team Fortress 2 is a free game that has in-game purchases that do not in any way change the core gameplay and are purely for cosmetic purposes that can actually be displayed to the general public. These are not mods, and Team Fortress 2 still receives gameplay-effecting updates along with the addition of more hats(less-so as of recently, supposedly due to the Source 2 port).

When it comes to a mod, the quality can very dramatically. Mods can range from incredibly game-changing to absolute shite. The judgement of these mods is subjective, where some will say one mod should deserve payment while others will say the opposite. To posit an example, I once found a mod for Fallout 3 that added a new female character that acted as a sister throughout the game. In theory, the idea behind this mod sounded great, but in practice, the voice-acting was mediocre, the dialogue was silly, and clips were repeated constantly. None of what I said was addressed on the Nexus showcase, so if this mod were to make it onto Steam Workshop I would demand my money back.

A better system for Valve to add would be the ability to donate to mod creators optionally, while still being able to download the mod for free. This system would work much better than an upfront payment as the mod developers will still, most likely, receive deserved support and users will continue to live on with the modding experience they always have.

Trialtrex21 wrote:A better system for Valve to add would be the ability to donate to mod creators optionally, while still being able to download the mod for free. This system would work much better than an upfront payment as the mod developers will still, most likely, receive deserved support and users will continue to live on with the modding experience they always have.

There was absolutely nothing stopping anyone from donating to a developer for a mod they like prior to this. If the users actually gave a shit about whether or not a developer is being compensated for their work, they'd contact the developer and donate directly. Regardless, I don't think mod developers should be forced to rely on donations as a method of generating revenue.

For the record, the "modding is just a hobby, not a job" argument is bullshit and you all know it.[1]

[1] Pretty clear example of the Is/Ought fallacy, among other issues.

I don't really see this ending well, even with a solid system people are going to whine about having to pay for content, there's already a petition with thousands of signatures to remove this thing. Plus Valve apparently only gives the creators 25% of the money made, which isn't good for those who like money.
I guess if mods for online games were visible to everyone on a server, since people who play games like TF2 and Payday already aren't above buying vanity cosmetics, it might be slightly more acceptable.

I wonder how far this will go overall. I imagine all the quality mods will become overpriced while the only free content are crappy MLP skins.

Awesomeguy147 wrote:Also, any one charges a dollar for a reskin is just being stupid and they shouldn't be surprised when nobody uses it......

5000 dollars for a frying pan.

Five.
Thousand.
Dollars.

(...) people are going to whine about having to pay for content (...)

Hakkla wrote:

(...) people are going to whine about having to pay for content (...)

Seriously though, optional donate button. Now.

Gaben, get off of your weed this instant.